The Next Crypto Boom Has Already Begun

Original Source: The Rollup

Original translation: Vernacular Blockchain

In this in-depth interview, we invited Alex Vanovic, co-founder and CEO of Nansen, to explore the future of on-chain analytics, the disruptive power of AI agents, and the grand vision of the crypto world moving towards the "real world era."

Alex will exclusively reveal how the Nansen mobile app transforms complex on-chain data into an intuitive "agent experience" through innovative AI agents, allowing users to track the movements of "smart money" as if they were talking to experts, and preview the upcoming transaction execution function.

In addition, as one of Hyperliquid's largest validators, he will analyze the three-stage model of the crypto narrative, from "innovation" to "overindustrialization." He will boldly predict how the on-chain integration of stablecoins and RWAs (real-world assets) will transform the current crypto market into a "toy world era." He will also share his unique insights on excessive financialization and Balaji's concept of a "cyber nation." Get ready to stand at the forefront of data science and gain a clear understanding of the future of crypto.

1. Nansen Mobile App and AI Agent

Host: Okay, let's talk. Nansen's mobile app is now live on the App Store! Can you explain why it's being called the best "agent experience" in crypto? What does it do for users?

Alex Vanovic: Exactly! One of the main issues we faced in the past was that users found the product difficult to use and didn't know which dashboard or metric to look at. So we thought, why not imagine what investing will look like in 2030 and then implement it now? For many software products, traditional user interfaces may be disappearing, and in the future you might just be talking to an AI agent.

After downloading the app, in addition to tracking your portfolio, the cool thing is that you have an AI agent that understands your portfolio and has access to all on-chain transaction data. This means you can ask it questions like, "Which meme coins on chains like Solana or Base have smart money bought in the past 30 minutes?" It will pull in data in real time and give you an answer within seconds.

You can choose between quick mode or expert mode. I can even paste in a transaction hash and it analyzes user behavior for me. It's a whole new way to navigate the blockchain.

Host: It's very intuitive. You can ask all sorts of questions about what the smart money is doing over different time periods. Ultimately, I think I can just say, "Do it for me! You know my risk tolerance and my trading preferences. Execute these trades."

Alex Vanovic: I love that you hit that point because that’s exactly where we’re headed! The obvious next step is to enable users to execute trades directly within the app, perhaps in November.

I think that after users have operated through this agent trading experience many times, they will begin to trust it and eventually think: "Why don't I just give it an overall strategy and let it execute it, and then I will monitor and check it?" This is a bit like Tesla's autonomous driving roadmap, which builds trust through years of use.

Host: I think of this as "ambient trading" or "ambient programming." You've tested a prototype with trade execution internally. What was it like?

Alex Vanovic: It's so much more fun than clicking through dashboards and looking at price charts! It's much smoother and more engaging. AI is great at simplifying complex processes, removing all the friction, so you can focus on what you want to do.

Our app now does this: once you enter the address you want to track, the homepage will generate personalized, pre-set prompts for you. For example, if your portfolio is rising, a card on the homepage will ask, "Why did Pangu (for example) rise today?" You don't even have to think about the question yourself; we've already prepared the prompt for you.

Host: As someone who's influenced by emotions, FOMO, and so on, it's hard to calmly evaluate your trading or investment performance. But with this app, you can ask, "What were my best trades? What mistakes did I make? What patterns do my mistakes have?" That's incredibly valuable.

Alexovic Vanovic: I totally agree! Using this app, you can clearly see your trading performance, identify error patterns, and analyze them calmly. This is not only practical, but also makes the whole process more fun and intuitive.

Host: Right? And in the future, are you planning to add more memory capabilities? So that the agent can understand more information, like why did I make this trade, or what my overall goal was?

Alex Vanovic: Exactly. We hope to add more memory features, similar to ChatGPT or Grok's memory files, to make the agent more personalized and useful. A user's trading rationale or overall strategy can be stored, making the agent increasingly intelligent and providing more targeted assistance.

2. Hyperliquid Validators and the Three Phases of Cryptographic Narratives

Host: Okay, Alex, I want to change the subject. Nansen is one of the largest validators on Hyperliquid. What's it like running a validator of that size? What challenges and controversies have you encountered?

Alex Vanovic: Yes, we are the largest validator on Hyperliquid, aside from the foundation. We started running a validator for Ronin about a year ago because we thought it was interesting and aligned with the community's interests. We acquired a small startup called Stake With Us, and now we have over $2 billion in staked assets, a 30x increase in just one year.

We quickly integrated Hyperliquid and decided to co-operate the validator with Hyperco. We were responsible for the technology, while Hyperco had a deep understanding of the ecosystem and played a key role in USDH governance voting.

Host: Speaking of that vote, I heard there was some controversy?

Alex Vanovic: Yes, I want to clear up some misconceptions. Some people think the outcome was predetermined, but that wasn't the case for us, at least. We carefully reviewed all proposals, spoke with all bidders, and spent a considerable amount of time analyzing them. We had an internal scoring system and encouraged more submissions. Ultimately, the committee abstained, leaving the decision entirely to the stakers. The result was very close, with Paxos coming in a close second.

Host: Native Markets has now staked and locked $200,000 in HYPE, ushering in a new era. Many stablecoin issuers have indicated they will continue to launch products on Hyperliquid. Is this something you hope to see?

Alex Vanovic: That's exactly what I was hoping for! Players like Paxos and Athena are excellent, and you want them all to build into the ecosystem. Beyond the token itself, I think these stablecoins will perform very well.

Host: As one of the largest validators, what do you think the next phase will be for Hyperliquid?

Alex Vanovic: It’s hard to say, the Hyperliquid ecosystem is so rich! I think all narratives or innovations in the crypto industry follow a three-stage process.

Innovation: Hyperliquid is an innovator in full-stack derivatives trading.

· Clones: Variations of similar concepts emerge.

Industrialized excess: Someone found a way to mass-produce these clones.

For example, in the case of memecoins, Dogecoin is the innovator, Pepe is the clone, and Pump.fun is the factory that produced 84 million memecoins.

Interestingly, Hyperliquid has a project called Based, which creates a Hyperliquid-like WordPress experience, allowing users to deploy their own front-end interface while still using Hyperliquid as the backend. This model is very clever, and perhaps the industrial overload will result in a large number of Hyperliquid front-ends, which is a good thing for Hyperliquiquid.

Host: You mentioned this, and I wonder who will be the winner? Will Hyperliquid continue to lead?

Alex Vanovic: This is a key question. While innovators can certainly be overtaken, Hyperliquid's unique advantage lies in its technology and community. If the industrial overhang is a bunch of Hyperliquid-based front ends, it's still core infrastructure and difficult to completely replace. However, competition will be fierce, and the future will be very interesting.

Host: This reminds me of Tether, the innovator of stablecoins, followed by clones like USDC, and now the industrialization phase. Do you think stablecoins or other categories have been overextended, or are some areas still very early days?

Alex Vanovic: Stablecoins themselves are very early in their development and they have a clear product-market fit. I think we could see trillions, or even tens of trillions of dollars in stablecoins minted in the next few years.

The Paxos example is interesting; they were making white-label stablecoins like BN USD until Gary Gensler (SEC Chairman) shut them down. They actually "lost" so many text messages and emails, it's outrageous. A multi-billion dollar business was destroyed overnight. Seriously, someone should seriously investigate this.

3. Real-world assets on-chain and excessive financialization

Host: Regarding the impact of stablecoins on the on-chain economy, do you think we can take a broader perspective?

Alex Vanovic: Stablecoins are one example of traditional financial assets being put on-chain, but the US dollar isn't the only asset that should be on-chain. In the coming years, securities, stocks, real estate, and more will all be put on-chain, dwarfing the size of the crypto market. Right now, the crypto market is still very small.

I’ve said before that in 2040 or 2050, when we look back at crypto history, we’ll see this period as the “Toy World Era.” We’ve created a lot of speculative, experimental tokens.

But the coming "real world era" will bring 100,000-fold, 1,000-million-fold value to blockchains. For example, why can't Nansen's equity be put on the blockchain? If young people could buy just 1% of a property and gradually accumulate it, it would be a game-changer. Blockchain mechanisms make asset mortgages much simpler.

Host: It’s interesting that you mentioned that the lending market and Aave will be the main beneficiaries of more value being on the chain.

Alex Vanovic: Yes, if you have Google stock or real estate, you'd want to use it as collateral for borrowing, which is very convenient. The core of the blockchain mechanism is to enable asset collateralization, making borrowing more efficient. I think Layer 1 assets, some Layer 2 assets, and protocols like Aave that clearly benefit from on-chain value creation are all good investments.

Host: As we move more assets onto blockchain, I want to ask a question about the over-financialization of the world. What are your thoughts on over-financialization?

Alex Vanovic: I'm more inclined to the Milton Friedman view that if people own something, they'll take better care of it. I think it's good for the world to have people own assets. We should strive to create a world where billions of people can be owners in some way, rather than the "you can own nothing and be happy" world that the World Economic Forum promotes.

Collateralization is interesting because it could lead to a divergence between hard and soft assets. You can deposit hard assets like Bitcoin and Ethereum in a DeFi "bank" and use them as collateral when you need them. Currently, this product is primarily available to wealthy individuals through wealth management services, but DeFi opens it up to everyone. This is very exciting.

4. The concept of a cyber nation

Moderator: You mentioned that people should have ownership of their networks or assets, which is central to Balaji's vision of a cyber nation. I know you visited his cyber school at the border. Can you share your experience there?

Alex Vanovic: It was a great experience. I attended a founder-to-founder event. It's still early days for online schools, but I'm very bullish on what Balaji is building. I love the futuristic feel of it, the feeling of everyone building the future together. Being around other builders creates a sense of possibility.

Host: What do you think is most attractive about the concept of a cyber nation?

Alex Vanovic: I grew up in Norway, and after moving abroad, I felt a stronger connection through the crypto community. In a sense, it's my primary community, and I feel a sense of belonging. But crypto isn't a country, so it's hard to feel patriotic about it. Balaji tries to make this sense of belonging more concrete, and I think many people can relate to it.

Who knows, maybe in a few years we'll all have internet passports! Following him is like a curiosity to see what his vision will eventually become. His vision is very relevant to our current times.

Host: Alex, thank you for joining us! Your holistic perspective on the industry and your ability to connect the dots are incredibly valuable.

Alex Vanovic: Thanks for having me! It’s a pleasure to be here.